Is Normal Maopping possible?

Hi all!

After reading this site:
http://www.glbenchmark.com/phonedetails.jsp?benchmark=pro&D=Apple%20iPhone&testgroup=gl

I realised iphone has GL_ARB_texture_env_dot3 extension, so my question is: Is it possible to use normal mapping on our favourite phone?

I researched a little bit and I found this:
http://www.imgtec.com/powervr/insider/demos/polybump.asp

Incredible, is that possible?

Thanks a lot!

Absolutely, I did some test on that and it work great however there's no "automatic" support for it at the moment (not in the v1.1 maybe in 1.2 not sure yet ), so you'll have to set the combiners manually but its not big deal and its really easy with SIO2, and you can use Blender to generate the vertex color which are supported at 100% in the SIO2 object file format.

I would also suggest you to check out this link:

http://oolongengine.com/

They have all (or almost) the POWERVR example ported to the iPhone.

Cheers,

I've attempted oolong. Unfortunately it's probably not beginner enough for me.

I can't even seem to load a custom .POD from Maya into the demo projects. Has anyone had any luck?

In a few days I will try it

With all my respect for the developer of OOlong, I wouldn't even call it an engine really, its basically just the official PowerVR examples that have been modified to work on the iPhone... there's no real "engine" or even a "scene manager" like in SIO2 most of the work needs to be "extensively" coded line by line by the user even for simple task.

I personally think (and no its not because I wrote it) that SIO2 is alot more user friendly executing for the user all theses tasks but have the ability to be flexible enough that if the user want to go more low level and execute them manually he can do it...

In example with OOlong to integrate physic on an object the user have to make the call for Bullet 1 by 1 with SIO2 its all in the file format and easily controlled using Blender. With SIO2 to put physic on a box its as simple as it is in Blender... but if the user want to gain control over the Physic object it can easily do it by getting the handle from the SIO2 object like I do in this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0vmgNJWJ1ug&fmt=18

The camera following the character is fully controlled by the Bullet API but all properties and rendering are all handle automatically in SIO2 from what you "click" in Blender.

In conclusion I think that with the design that I apply in SIO2 it makes the engine easy to use for beginner and give give access to all possibility to more advanced user, which is great and exactly what Im looking for in an engine.

Please take note that once again Im just sharing my opinion here and the guy of OOlong deserve credits as well, actually to be honest for the particle system in SIO2 I check the code that he port in order to integrate it inside the core

sio2interactive wrote:Absolutely, I did some test on that and it work great however there's no "automatic" support for it at the moment (not in the v1.1 maybe in 1.2 not sure yet ), so you'll have to set the combiners manually but its not big deal,

Hi Thanks for this information. I was really worried about making a game on for the iPhone until I read this. I have two questions:

1.) What do you mean by, "set the combiners" and how is this done?

2.) Normal mapping is really only half the battle, the other is specularity. This is the same for bump mapping too. In a lot of cases you need the highlights to show the bumps and distortions of the normals. is specularity even posable (not talking about spec mapping but that would be good too)?

I also want to say, Thanks! You are doing an amazing job and this is turing out to be such a great engine.

-=GB=-

1.) What do you mean by, "set the combiners" and how is this done?

>> Checkout any OpenGL Dot3 tutorials it'll show you how to do it.

2.) Normal mapping is really only half the battle, the other is specularity. This is the same for bump mapping too. In a lot of cases you need the highlights to show the bumps and distortions of the normals. is specularity even posable (not talking about spec mapping but that would be good too)?

>> Remember that only 2 texture channels are available here, and there's no shader, so knowing theses limitations, checkout what combinations give you the the best result for what are you trying to achieve... If you want my personal reference you can base yourself on the visual of Quake3++ that's about the kind of realism that you can achieve with the device.

I also want to say, Thanks! You are doing an amazing job and this is turing out to be such a great engine.

>> Tks man, I appreciate that, more stuff are on the way... Time is my only problem here

So, I'll need to do some programing. Darn! I'm a 3D artist not a programer. That's why I wanted to use your tools in the first place. Otherwise, I would just write my own game engine. Anyway, I guess I'll have to wait until you implement Normal mapping. I did check out a bunch of Dot3 registry combiner tutorials just now and I think it's going to be way beyond my abilities. Besides, I already have to build all the models, make all the textures, rig and animate all the character actions, etc., etc. That's a lot to do.

Anything you can do to help out us non-programers would really help in a big way. I understand that that is what this whole project is all about and I totally appreciate that. But I think that Normal mapping is a very important thing. I think Normal Mapping is going to be essential to making 3D games in OpenGL ES really stand out. Normal Mapping is actually a really good way to help you optimize your scenes/levels/characters. You can used a lot less polygons if the details are stored in Maps instead. I hope you will consider adding normal map support sooner then latter is all I'm asking.

Thanks!

-=GB=-

So, I'll need to do some programing. Darn! I'm a 3D artist not a programer. That's why I wanted to use your tools in the first place. Otherwise, I would just write my own game engine.

>> Well I think you misunderstood what SIO2 is all about... it is a 3D engine and you HAVE to write your own code/scripts in order to make things possible...

Oh, sorry. I did misunderstand. But in my defense, After watching all those videos you made, I just assumed that because you rarely show any coding. You've made it look like it's really easy and simple. That's what attracted me to SIO2 in the first place. I thought SIO2 was about building the mechanics of a game in Blender and just exporting it to your game engine.

Unfortunately no such tools is available at the moment, and even in blender if you want to create a game you have to code you know... It is impossible to have a tool that literally build everything for you cuz there's too many possibilities...

Hmm. I didn't realize that but I guess you are right. I thought that Unity3D was that way but I just checked it out and it's the same as what you say (more advanced because it's been out longer).

Is there some code out there that I can just copy and paste or does it need to be handled on an individual basis? Maybe some kind sole on the forum can help me out.

Thanks for taking the time to explain it to me.

Is there some code out there that I can just copy and paste or does it need to be handled on an individual basis?

>> That why the tutorials in the SDK and the video tutorials are out there... To give you simple example in order for you to take them to the next level inside your own app.

sio2interactive wrote:Is there some code out there that I can just copy and paste or does it need to be handled on an individual basis?

>> That why the tutorials in the SDK and the video tutorials are out there... To give you simple example in order for you to take them to the next level inside your own app.

I meant, specifically about normal mapping.

Thanks!

-=GB=-

ho! sorry I misunderstood that should get you started:

http://www.codesampler.com/oglsrc/oglsrc_4.htm

Check out the Dot3 example...